MHM Forum

Transcription of the Virtual Conference held on the 5th June 2007:

<andreapixel> I think most countries are there
<IlseGE> hello everybody. nice to meet you again
<FredFR> Hello from Marika and Frédéric from France
<AndreasDE> Yes, you´re right. Germany is going to conduct the session.
<andreapixel> Ok Greco to start....
<MathiasBE> hello from Belgium, Liège
<seron> salut
<andreapixel> Go
<ein> What we do first?
<AndreasDE> OK, let´s start with the first impulse.
<AndreasDE> To what extent has the world´s worst nuclear power accident at the Chernobyl nuclear plant changed common perceptions of and attitudes towards nuclear power in your countries? Did commentators advocate plans for phasing out or shutting down nuclear power units in the aftermath of Chernobyl (as they did in Germany)?
<Anon098> Hello
<FredFR> There was no plan to stop the French nuclear  programme
<Anon098> I think the problem really changed the perspective, since we also had an elaborate discussion about our nuclear power in Zarnowiec, in Poland.
<IlseGE> in Germany there was a great fear about the followings
<Anon098> However, the problem of Chernobyl was an alarming point within the discussion.
<ein> We have new project in Poland. Maybe we will star building nuclear power plant in future
<AndreasDE> Right. In Germany all politcal parties have agreed on shutting down all our nuclear plants till 2020.
<ChristineBE> At the time of the events, Belgium was already equipped with several nuclear power stations. In Belgium as in the other countries, exploitation of nuclear energy was facing an acute opposition, which reinforced after the Chernobyl catastrophe.
<seronIT> The old nuclear plants were dismissed after the referendum and the public opinion is still mostly against
<ChristineBE> The Chernobyl accident led the press to question on the so-called safety of the Belgian nuclear power stations
<Anonymous> In Poland, there is a kind of advocacy for the nuclear power.
<AndreasDE> (So-called safety is a nice way to put it...) Have you been setting up any new plants recently?
<AndreasDE> Does collective memory of the Chernobyl disaster still play a role in public debates on nuclear power?
<seronIT> No, we are not planning any nuclear plants...
<ein> Now, not to much extent in Poland.
<FredFR> There was no change on the French Nuclear programme -
<ChristineBE> Today, two nuclear power stations are still in service on the Belgian territory (Tihange and Doel).
<FredFR> Such an accident has been "forgotten" -  this didn't hamper the development of new nuclear plants
<AndreasDE> Does the memory of Chernobyl still play a role in the French debates on nuclear power. Is there a debate at all?
<AndreasDE> Totally different here in Germany. Only after the debates on global warming has nuclear power been advocated again by some (liberal-conservative) political forces.
<ein> In the energetical context, in Poland there is a tendency to get free of energetical dependancy.
<seronIT> We are trying to exploit other renewable energies, like wind mills or thermodynamic solar or biomass energy.
<FredFR> France has resorted to nuclear for a long time (back to the 70's) - just only some activists and environmentalists reactes against nuclear programmes.
<ein> In Poland, people are getting more and more confident as regards the nuclear power.
<ChristineBE> According to some scientists, nuclear is better for environment than fossil energies
<FredFR> what was the reaction about the communication mode and policy of the USSR as far as the event was concerned;
<AndreasDE> It was considere to be the prime part of the scandal here in Germany.
<ein> This model of communication was criticised in Poland, it cast a flash on the Soviet way of thinking (the same was later with Kursk affair)
<seronIT> Also in Italy people were worried about the reality of the event.
<AndreasDE> Sources we have found consider the Chernoby disaster as the beginneing of the end of the Communist system and its auhtoritarian informnation policy.
<ChristineBE> The Belgian press unanimously criticizes the Soviet authorities because they provided tardy, perfunctory and inaccurate information. At least on this point the official declarations join the opinion of the press and of the Belgian population.
<seronIT> And public opinion was always involved.
<ein> We felt the Soviet aUthorities were forced to reactions after the west signals of threat.
Cernobyl. There you can see that the information in USSR was really bad. The people who worked there directly after the accident became sick and a lot of thme died.   
<AndreasDE> Here in Germany we were not satisfied with the information policy of our own authorities. There was a lot of chaos as to whether our health was at risk or not.
<IlseDE> Concerning the information policy: last year I was in Ukraine in the museum of Cernobyl. There you can see that the information in USSR was really bad. The people who worked there directly after the accident became sick and a lot of thme died.   
<AndreasDE> Here in Germany we were not satisfied with the information policy of our own authorities. There was a lot of chaos as to whether our health was at risk or not.
<FredFR> was any  minimization of the real risks in other countries ?   
<ein> Accordin to our sources the Ukrainian people were not fully conscious and educated about the importance of the event.
<ChristineBE> The Belgian authorities repeat that dangerous radioactivity rates have never been reached in the air, nor in foodstuffs, nor in drinkable water on the Belgian territory. It is just because of prevention that “extreme safety measures� have been recommended since the accident : cleaning of fresh vegetables, and also keeping milch cows inside the cowshed.
<AndreasDE> And probably still aren´t...
<FredFR> In France,  official communiqués reported that the nuclear cloud did not reach our country - the truth was concealed.
<MichaelDE> prbably to avoid panic reactions
<seronIT> Also in Italy people were worried about the reality of the event.
<AndreasDE> Sources we have found consider the Chernoby disaster as the beginneing of the end of the Communist system and its auhtoritarian informnation policy.
<ChristineBE> The Belgian press unanimously criticizes the Soviet authorities because they provided tardy, perfunctory and inaccurate information. At least on this point the official declarations join the opinion of the press and of the Belgian population.
<seronIT> And public opinion was always involved.
<ein> We felt the Soviet aUthorities were forced to reactions after the west signals of threat.
<IlseDE> Concerning the information policy: last year I was in Ukraine in the museum of Cernobyl. There you can see that the information in USSR was really bad. The people who worked there directly after the accident became sick and a lot of thme died.   
<AndreasDE> Here in Germany we were not satisfied with the information policy of our own authorities. There was a lot of chaos as to whether our health was at risk or not.
<FredFR> In France,  official communiqués reported that the nuclear cloud did not reach our country - the truth was concealed.
<MichaelDE> prbably to avoid panic reactions
<IlseDE> no, ukrainian people are honoured as heroes nowadays.
<FredFR> this went further - just in order to protect and legitimize the nuclear programme
<ChristineBE> In Belgium, many articles frankly criticize the Belgian or foreign “official information�, because all sources want to minimize the accident extent
<MichaelDE> the panic was strong enough over here despite our government playing down the threat
<FredFR> In France there are still today trials
<seronIT> In Italy public opinion concentrated on effects of the disaster on people's health and people decided not to use milk, fresh vegetables, mushrooms and anything growning in the open air.
<AndreasDE> Trials related to what exactly (in France...)
<MichaelDE> the rush for dehydrated milk was incredible
<ein> In Poland, this event was barely minimized.
<FredFR> because some information were retained deliberatly by authorities involved in the nuclear programmes.
<MichaelDE> @fr ... and people now ask for compensation?
<AndreasDE> You mean the Polish authorities openly published all the information available?
<FredFR> compensation to aknowledge some diseases related to this accident.
<ein> Openly- not, but the society's inlook was clear.
<AndreasDE> In Germany the Green Party has been gaining in strength since Chernobyl. To what extent did ecology-minded parties or movements play a role in the public debates after the disaster?
<ChristineBE> After the disaster, the Belgian ecology-minded parties (especially the movement “ECOLO�) were reinforced in the public debates against nuclear power but they didn’t achieve to shut down power units.
<ein> To speak frankly, in Poland we have rather a lack of really declared green parties producing some essential points of view.
<AndreasDE> Have they become an influential force within the public debates (in Belgium and France)?
<IlseDE> What about the italians?
<AndreasDE> Anybody out there?
<MichaelDE> 59 nuclear powerplants in France! http://www.euronuclear.org/info/maps.htm
<ChristineBE> They are not major parties in Belgium...
<AndreasDE> Congradulations!
<MathiasBE> yes but not so strong than in Germany
<FredFR> ecology has become a force with any political connotation -
<ChristineBE> 2 in Belgium
<FredFR> we are the best in that domain- Should we be proud of it ?????
<MichaelDE> 7 for Belgium, says the source
<AndreasDE> My congradulations were related to the number of atomic power units...
<seronIT> In Italy the Green Party was formed after the disaster but it's a little party because most of the major political parties have ecological objectives in their programme and the Green Party influences them.
<MathiasBE> in Belgium (now since ten years) ECOLO is left political party
<FredFR> SAME IN FRANCE
<AndreasDE> Same here in Germany
<AndreasDE> Talking about left-wing political attitudes: Did the disaster increase doubts about other issues having to do with atomic technology, particularly about the disposal of nuclear waste or the installation of nuclear weapons?
<ChristineBE> The disaster increased doubts about all issues having to do with atomic technology
<MichaelDE> I joined you a little late - did I miss the talk about the Wall?
<AndreasDE> No you haven´t..
<FredFR> welcome - but we can start about this topic
<AndreasDE> Yes why not. First I´d like to know wheter ecological matters were connected to pacifist ones after Chernobyl...
<AndreasDE> What´s your strongest memory of the Fall of 89?
<ein> The Berlin Wall's Fall was treated according to the Polish sources acted as simbol of the Communism's destruction.
<Annette> My stronges memory is Mr. Genscher at the embassy telling the people that they may travel.
<MathiasBE> i was student in history in university
<AndreasDE> Me too...
<MathiasBE> we speek all days with other students
<ein> We see this within some sequence of events. Firs- solidarity, second- Gorbachec, third- the Round Table Talks in Poland
<MathiasBE> some of us (not me sorry) go during the night to Berlin
<FredFR> what was striking was  the popular jubilation in  Berlin.
<AndreasDE> Joining the big party...
<AndreasDE> In the fall of 1989 Germans were in a state of national euphoria for many weeks. To what extent did the public and your media share the joy and euphoria that accompanied the wall's fall in 1989?
<MathiasBE> The ambiance lived by the Berliners have widely been broadcasted by the media in Belgium. Thus many newspapers dispatched several special correspondents who cover each moment of that crazy weekend lived by the Germans through reportages, interviews, photos
<FredFR> Same in France but French authorities remaines "coldish" especially our President Mitterand.
<AndreasDE> Interesting - Were there any voices to be heard that were critical of what was going on in Germany in the fall of 1989? Were there, for example, growing fears regarding what kind of role a unified Germany would hold in Europe and in the world; fears of Germany as a new military superpower, reminding of the Nazi past?
<MichaelDE> I was searched for east German money at the makeshift "customs office" (a wooden box) close to the Brandenburg Gate. Two days later the "office" was gone ... and so was the beautiful east German customs officer.
<MathiasBE> The return to a large Germany in Europe (and thus a mostly economical and demographic domination of a new Germany) is evoked in several newspapers as the opinion of Belgian and European politicians. But from the side of USSR, the changes seem to be accepted if the boundaries of after-Yalta aren’t questioned as well as the existence itself (in a first time) of both German states
<FredFR> There was a certain fear of a reunified Germany
<ein> In Poland it was really an euphoric opinion about opening the so called new card of Europe.
<MathiasBE> In the West we consider that Germany in the bosom of the Twelve will not constitute any danger if it fulfils its European commitment
<AndreasDE> No fears in Poland - related to the past of the second world war?
<FredFR> france feared that Germany might remain self centered about its own power to the detriment of the European Union.
<ein> In Poland, then absolutely not.
<AndreasDE> Was the fall of the Berlin Wall immediately considered to be the first step toward German reunification?
<FredFR> But in France we have a stronger  notion  about the French/German Match.
<MathiasBE> In Belgium, not in an automatic manner, on the contrary, newspapers evoke the Wall Fall as a step toward an evolution that isn’t specially reunification. Other scenarios are envisaged (status quo, confederacy, balkanisation,…). Media are quite prudent regarding the coming weeks, the reactions of USSR, etc.   
<AndreasDE> (We´ve really become good friends, haven´t we, Fred?)
<FredFR> François Mittérand was wrong - we trully remained good friends - did we Andrea ?
<AndreasDE> Here in germany it took several months to make up our minds. It wasn´t clear right from the beginning that the process would lead ou to reunification.
<FredFR> In France, we expected a confederation and not a reunification.
<AndreasDE> In Germany you can still hear voices critical of reunification. (One is sitting right next me...)
<FredFR> sorry, but we have to go... unfortunately. Would it be possible to send us a copy of this chat Andrea. Our best regards.... Cheers. Arriverdici -
<AndreasDE> Some just don´t approve of the East German dialects...
<AndreasDE> Next impulse: Was the fall of the Berlin Wall immediately considered to be the first step toward the end of communism in Eastern Europe, and, in a broader sense, the end of the Cold War?
<ein> You mean political or natural dialects, Andreas?
<AndreasDE> The German they speak in Saxony sure is something we had to get used to...
<MathiasBE> No, in Belgium, the press keeps prudent. It only states that the events rushes and catches everybody unawares. Of course we have the feeling to live a radical change of the situation through press articles, but at that time we are still too close to the events and the reactions of both camps aren’t known yet and furthermore, USSR and USA ask the West Germans not to make things go even faster. Even for France, via Mitterand,
<AndreasDE> Similar reactions here in Germany...
<ein> We, in Poland, thougt to think about a spontaneous revolution, not in the frames of temporary politics.
<ein> Maybe, that's naive, however we saw all this in some "magical" perspective.
<AndreasDE> It was incredible, wasn´t it?
<IlseDE> Do you believe that the wall fall is an european event or does the public in your country estimate it as a internal German problem?
<MathiasBE> for belgian press it's a historical event
<ein> We used treat in a wide context, not as a seperate German issue.
<MathiasBE> the most important since end of the WWII
<ein> For us too.
<MichaelDE> It was absolutely spectacular - even the US took notice within a few hours.
<MichaelDE> (-;
<AndreasDE> In Germany the Fall of the Berlin Wall is commonly termed “The Turnâ€� (Die Wende) or “The Peaceful Revolution of the Fall of  ‘89â€� (Die friedliche Revolution vom Herbst ’89). What terms and phrases are commonly used in your countries?
<MathiasBE> In Begium, the press mentions the words « revolution in freedom » as Chancellor Kohl’s words. Newspapers display titles dealing more with the wall and its disappearance.
<ein> Our quasi definition was the Autumn of Folks.
<MathiasBE> for example:« The Western rush » (La Meuse)
<MathiasBE> example:“The end of the post-war, Germany : the new dimension, Europe : the new continent, the World : the new balance� (Le Vif/L’Express)
<ein> Thank you very much for the fruitful discussion. We hope we will be avoiding technical problems and we'll be meeting on next on- line conferences.
<MichaelDE> must go --- virus alarm on the system
<AndreasDE> We have one more question to you: What major reasons do your sources give for the fall of the wall and the decline of the communist system in Eastern Germay?
<MathiasBE> For the belgian press, the reforms started by Gorbatchev in USSR and mostly his politics of non-intervention in the Eastern Countries. The General Secretary of the Communist party emphasizes that he won’t intervene in the satellite countries. Furthermore the internal crisis of the Communist party of the GDR is often quoted in the press.
<AndreasDE> What elements of crisis we´re commented on, as far as the GDR is concerned?
<MathiasBE> in the press, during many weeks, it explain that the communist party in GDR was in crisis
<MathiasBE> no solutions of the economic problem in GDR
<MathiasBE> no help from USSR
<MathiasBE> to solve economic problem
<AndreasDE> Here in Germany we generally think the major reasons were the economic crisis oand, as you´re saying, a lack of credibility on the part of the communist party.
<AndreasDE> And the opening of the iron curtain on the part of the Hungarians was essential, of course...
<MathiasBE> Gorbatchev was full with his problem in USSR
<IlseDE> dear colleagues, you are very silent today - do you have good wheather and want to go out later??
<MathiasBE> yes it's ths sunshine
<AndreasDE> It´s been my first time chatting with you guys - and it´s been a great plaesure!
<MathiasBE> no rain in Belgium